When Democrats in the New York State Legislature heard that Governor DeSantis had taken control of his state’s redistricting process to redraw the map so that five Democratic congress members would go down to defeat this fall (as they did), they decided two could play that game, and created an aggressive gerrymander to give them five formerly-Republican House seats and become the “saviors of the House majority.”
'The New York Times spoke with Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who won her own race handily, about the New York results and calls from her and fellow progressives to oust the state party chairman, Jay Jacobs.'
'Her comments added fuel to a heated intraparty debate over what went wrong, who to blame and how to course correct.'
'Here is the edited and condensed interview.'
So why did Democrats perform so poorly in New York on Tuesday?
A lot of this has roots with Andrew Cuomo. A lot of what he did to the state and Democratic Party as governor led to this moment. But it’s not really about placing blame on him, but examining what the New York State Democratic Party looks like. It is not a small “D” democratic structure. As a consequence, we do not have the rich democratic culture and organizing that should be happening year-round, from the way that we select town councils and mayorships across the state of New York. The absence of that results in a lot of what we saw.
What do you mean by that? How much is organizing and how much is messaging?
It’s no secret that an enormous amount of party leadership in New York State is based on big money and old-school, calcified machine-style politics that creates a very anemic voting base that is disengaged and disenfranchised.
There is also a narrative problem when you look at what New York did. This overreliance and insistence on leaning into Republican narratives on crime and safety hurt Democrats in the state of New York.
Instead of ignoring or even pivoting and commanding the narrative on crime and public safety, a lot of Democrats leaned into Lee Zeldin’s approach.
Gov. Kathy Hochul did try to do that to an extent, right? She repeatedly tried to bring the discussion back to the proliferation of guns and gun safety.
She absolutely put in that effort, but it’s a team sport. When you have certain congressional candidates running ads on defund the police, when we have the mayor speaking from certain frames on crime and safety, I think it further drives these narratives.
Not once has the New York State Democratic chair ever called me. All he has done is antagonize myself and any progressive candidates. We need to get together as a team. This idea of pure moderate politics that seeks to defeat both a progressive grass roots and a Republican Party at the same time very often isolates itself and makes itself smaller.
A lot of Hochul’s messaging was about why not to vote for Zeldin. Did she do a good enough job laying out a proactive vision for the state?
We as a party benefit from being very assertive about our vision and explaining not just what the stakes are and not just the consequences of what would happen given Republican victory, but also to lay down a vision and be unafraid about what we will do with power.
We can be a state like California that puts things like public banking on the ballot. We have bills in the State Legislature right now like the Build Public Renewables Act that is profoundly motivating.
I don’t think its just turnout. Leaning into Republican messaging hurts persuasion, too.
Hello Victoria. Thank you for reading the Times' interview with AOC. I don't think that you were asking me to address your skepticism of 'progressives' nor do I know how acquainted you are with 'exactly what they want to accomplish'. (NY State)
I am not an advocate for progressives in this state or the Progressive Caucus of the House of Representatives, although I am often in agreement with their positions and legislative initiatives On the other hand, while I vote for Democratic Party candidates, I am more a critic than fan of the Party's work on the national, state and local levels.
Below is a link to another interview with AOC, which is more detailed.
If you are not familiar with the Gotham Gazette, you may find it a worthwhile source about NYS and NYC politics from time to time. A link to it has also been provided below.
'AOC blames Democrat loss on corruption, slander, Big Money'
'In addition to demanding that Jay Jacobs resign, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez had some criticism regarding the functionality of the Democrat Party.'
Victoria, Sean Patrick Maloney, five-term incumbent from New York’s Hudson Valley and architect of the Democratic midterm campaign lost his is seat in the house. NY Times reporter, Paul Kane, interviewed him after his loss. An excerpt of that interview is below. He repays AOC's critical words with some of his own for her.
'Sean Patrick Maloney on His Loss, the Media and A.O.C.'
'Mr. Maloney said that he and other New York Democrats were unable to overcome suburban fears of crime. He also had some harsh words for Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.'
'Again, New York is home to the fiercest outlet in the News Corporation fear machine. In fairness to the governor, she and the rest of us have to contend with the hysteria of The New York Post and of Fox News combined. But if you look at her own race, they clearly understood they had to answer the charges and began to do so late.'
'If what you are looking for is a post-mortem on the best House Democratic midterm since John Kennedy was in the White House, I’ll pass.'
'It would be nice to take one day off from focusing on why everything is terrible. Yes, I lost my race. Yes, we struggled in suburban New York on the same night we won 213 to 215 seats when everybody including you thought we were going to lose 40 or 50. So you tell me, was it a good night or a bad one?'
'You want to focus on what went wrong in New York, I got it. But I’m at least as focused on what went right everywhere else. But you get to ask the questions.'
'I’m sorry, I am going to keep asking them.'
'I’m not at all surprised.'
'We definitely struggled around the city. I don’t fully understand why. I do think that Democrats should always seek to understand what we can do better, and we are clearly, at least here in New York, not connecting well with suburban voters who strongly opposed the top of the ticket and with that, candidates down ballot.'
'Do you have any advice for Mike Lawler, who will start out as a top 2024 target on Day 1 in a seat Democrats may well win back?'
'No, I don’t think two days after the election there is anything for me to say except I wish him well, and I hope he understands how special and wonderful an opportunity it is to work with people of the Hudson Valley. I’m grateful to have had that experience and I hope he finds it as rewarding as I do.'
'There is a debate in New York right now about the New York Democratic Party, and Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and some on the left are arguing its leadership is part of the problem here. Is that a conversation you are a part of?'
'The last time I ran into A.O.C., we were beating her endorsed candidate two to one in a primary, and I didn’t see her one minute of these midterms helping our House majority. So, I’m not sure what kind of advice she has, but I’m sure she’ll be generous with it.'
'But let’s be clear, she had almost nothing to do with what turned out to be an historic defense of our majority. Didn’t pay a dollar of dues. Didn’t do anything for our frontline candidates except give them money when they didn’t want it from her.'
'There are other voices who should be heard, especially when suburban voters have clearly rejected the ideas that she’s most associated with, from defunding the police on down. She’s an important voice in our politics. But when it comes to passing our agenda through the Congress, or standing our ground on the political battlefield, she was nowhere to be found.'
'Nationally, what are one or two things that surprised you in a positive way for the performance that allowed you to beat historic odds?'
'It was clearly a combination of having tackled real problems, bringing home real deliverables and running good campaigns, and our candidates. Both our incumbents and our challengers deserve enormous credit for the hard work they put in and the results they turned in, which as far as I can tell, exceed those of any House Democratic majority going back 60 years.'
'Here in New York, how much do you think redistricting mattered in the end?'
'If the top of the ticket is getting smoked in the New York City suburbs, you’re going to lose seats because those districts always have a degree of competitiveness. Albany passed different maps and the commission passed different maps, so it’s hard to talk in generalities.'
'But if you look at the districts in the Hudson Valley and on Long Island, it’s fair to say that we would have always struggled in an environment where the governor’s losing by double digits in those areas. Different lines wouldn’t have made much difference.'
'Pat Ryan is running in a district that was easier than mine. I’m running in a district that was easier than my old one. It’s just when you have voters in the booth who are voting against the top of the ticket by double digits, it’s very hard, particularly for a first-time candidate like some of ours, to overcome that.'
'Look, that’s not the only reason. And again, I don’t think it’s Gov. Hochul’s fault. But we clearly had a problem in the New York City suburbs that just didn’t exist elsewhere in the country, and I’m sure there’s enough blame to go around.'
Well, I will bet the Texas Democratic Party could out screw any pouch. Disarray, disorganized, dis-funded, discombobulated, disassociated, disengaged.. And the chairman just got re elected this summer at the TDP Convention which was, by the way, a GOAT SCREWING! He is underhanded and dishonest and won by cheating. He has done ZERO for Democrats in this state. Notice how Beto had very little to do with them? Seriously, they act like Republicans. I am left wondering...is there any difference? Move along America, nothing to see here in the grand old Lone Star State. It’s a dumpster fire. The GOP has gerrymandering and voter suppression down to a science. Let’s hope other states don’t look over here for some tips. Not one fucking thing changed here during this election. Greg FUCKING Abbott got 4 more miserable years. I am sick and hopeless, but at least I have a GENERATOR!! Sorry for the rant
You may or may not have noticed, I, too, have rant tendencies... well done 👍🏼. I’m in IN ... I feel like we’re the Texas of the Midwest... we are RED hot, with a few blue pockets, mostly around universities.
Rant on, Rachel! I live in the dominantly blue People’s Republic of Massachusetts where I’m ecstatic that we just elected our former awesome kick-butt attorney gerneral Maura Healy as our first elected woman governor of the state and first out gay woman governor in the country along with a slate of amazing women leaders. But I still rant about the deplorable dominance of MAGA maniacs and fascists in so many states. Thank you for fighting the good fight in Texas! Have you connected with Blue Horizon Texas yet? They’re working hard and smart to organize and multiply the political power of Texas Democrats and progressives.
Three things: First: boy, did we ever fuck the pooch; Second: one of the dipsticks elected to the House is the former Dutchess County Executive, Marcus Molinaro, a man whose lake of IQ points can be skated on, year-round (he comes to Washington complete with his educational credentials—a 2 year degree in political science from Dutchess Community College glistening in the sunshine); third: the execrable Elise Stefanik won her 5th term in the House.
This is disturbingly infuriating. You know, I was listening to Professor Richardson’s talk from June 30 of this year. It’s on YouTube, if you care to listen to it. She explains clearly how we got here and who the “Originalists” are... without the backstory, which I’ve never seen laid out so succinctly as she managed, we’re just going to continue to flail. She does offer suggestions, but... sadly, my faith in the democrats is tanking. There’s cause to revise states rights, but it won’t happen with 5 of 9 SC judges being Originalists. We have to expand the court. And ... we have two years. How?
You're right about New York TAFM readers, of which I am one. I, and I'm quite certain many others, are royally pissed at the stupidity of our NY Dem Party! Thanks for seeing that we're not all fools!
Having been born and raised for the
near first quarter century of my life in upstate NY, I have been appalled
at the latest dumb moves of my fellow Democrats in my home state.
Being a military wife, I got to move
move around a lot. I learned a lot too, especially from our southern
adventures. Upstate had always been a safe harbor...going home.
I know things change. People and
times change, but you don't have
to play around with lines on maps
in either NY, FL, AL or any other
effing state to totally disenfranchise
your electorate. And yes, it will come down the pike for DeSantis
and what's her name in Alabama.
Karma is a bitch.
'The New York Times spoke with Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who won her own race handily, about the New York results and calls from her and fellow progressives to oust the state party chairman, Jay Jacobs.'
'Her comments added fuel to a heated intraparty debate over what went wrong, who to blame and how to course correct.'
'Here is the edited and condensed interview.'
So why did Democrats perform so poorly in New York on Tuesday?
A lot of this has roots with Andrew Cuomo. A lot of what he did to the state and Democratic Party as governor led to this moment. But it’s not really about placing blame on him, but examining what the New York State Democratic Party looks like. It is not a small “D” democratic structure. As a consequence, we do not have the rich democratic culture and organizing that should be happening year-round, from the way that we select town councils and mayorships across the state of New York. The absence of that results in a lot of what we saw.
What do you mean by that? How much is organizing and how much is messaging?
It’s no secret that an enormous amount of party leadership in New York State is based on big money and old-school, calcified machine-style politics that creates a very anemic voting base that is disengaged and disenfranchised.
There is also a narrative problem when you look at what New York did. This overreliance and insistence on leaning into Republican narratives on crime and safety hurt Democrats in the state of New York.
Instead of ignoring or even pivoting and commanding the narrative on crime and public safety, a lot of Democrats leaned into Lee Zeldin’s approach.
Gov. Kathy Hochul did try to do that to an extent, right? She repeatedly tried to bring the discussion back to the proliferation of guns and gun safety.
She absolutely put in that effort, but it’s a team sport. When you have certain congressional candidates running ads on defund the police, when we have the mayor speaking from certain frames on crime and safety, I think it further drives these narratives.
Not once has the New York State Democratic chair ever called me. All he has done is antagonize myself and any progressive candidates. We need to get together as a team. This idea of pure moderate politics that seeks to defeat both a progressive grass roots and a Republican Party at the same time very often isolates itself and makes itself smaller.
A lot of Hochul’s messaging was about why not to vote for Zeldin. Did she do a good enough job laying out a proactive vision for the state?
We as a party benefit from being very assertive about our vision and explaining not just what the stakes are and not just the consequences of what would happen given Republican victory, but also to lay down a vision and be unafraid about what we will do with power.
We can be a state like California that puts things like public banking on the ballot. We have bills in the State Legislature right now like the Build Public Renewables Act that is profoundly motivating.
I don’t think its just turnout. Leaning into Republican messaging hurts persuasion, too.
###
While she has some good points here, Fern, I have some skepticism
concerning the "progressives" and
exactly what they want to accomplish. Division within the
party, especially during an election
period, is not a good idea.
Hello Victoria. Thank you for reading the Times' interview with AOC. I don't think that you were asking me to address your skepticism of 'progressives' nor do I know how acquainted you are with 'exactly what they want to accomplish'. (NY State)
I am not an advocate for progressives in this state or the Progressive Caucus of the House of Representatives, although I am often in agreement with their positions and legislative initiatives On the other hand, while I vote for Democratic Party candidates, I am more a critic than fan of the Party's work on the national, state and local levels.
Below is a link to another interview with AOC, which is more detailed.
If you are not familiar with the Gotham Gazette, you may find it a worthwhile source about NYS and NYC politics from time to time. A link to it has also been provided below.
'AOC blames Democrat loss on corruption, slander, Big Money'
'In addition to demanding that Jay Jacobs resign, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez had some criticism regarding the functionality of the Democrat Party.'
https://english.almayadeen.net/news/politics/aoc-blames-democrat-loss-on-corruption-slander-big-money
https://www.gothamgazette.com/
Victoria, Sean Patrick Maloney, five-term incumbent from New York’s Hudson Valley and architect of the Democratic midterm campaign lost his is seat in the house. NY Times reporter, Paul Kane, interviewed him after his loss. An excerpt of that interview is below. He repays AOC's critical words with some of his own for her.
'Sean Patrick Maloney on His Loss, the Media and A.O.C.'
'Mr. Maloney said that he and other New York Democrats were unable to overcome suburban fears of crime. He also had some harsh words for Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.'
'Again, New York is home to the fiercest outlet in the News Corporation fear machine. In fairness to the governor, she and the rest of us have to contend with the hysteria of The New York Post and of Fox News combined. But if you look at her own race, they clearly understood they had to answer the charges and began to do so late.'
'If what you are looking for is a post-mortem on the best House Democratic midterm since John Kennedy was in the White House, I’ll pass.'
'It would be nice to take one day off from focusing on why everything is terrible. Yes, I lost my race. Yes, we struggled in suburban New York on the same night we won 213 to 215 seats when everybody including you thought we were going to lose 40 or 50. So you tell me, was it a good night or a bad one?'
'You want to focus on what went wrong in New York, I got it. But I’m at least as focused on what went right everywhere else. But you get to ask the questions.'
'I’m sorry, I am going to keep asking them.'
'I’m not at all surprised.'
'We definitely struggled around the city. I don’t fully understand why. I do think that Democrats should always seek to understand what we can do better, and we are clearly, at least here in New York, not connecting well with suburban voters who strongly opposed the top of the ticket and with that, candidates down ballot.'
'Do you have any advice for Mike Lawler, who will start out as a top 2024 target on Day 1 in a seat Democrats may well win back?'
'No, I don’t think two days after the election there is anything for me to say except I wish him well, and I hope he understands how special and wonderful an opportunity it is to work with people of the Hudson Valley. I’m grateful to have had that experience and I hope he finds it as rewarding as I do.'
'There is a debate in New York right now about the New York Democratic Party, and Representative Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and some on the left are arguing its leadership is part of the problem here. Is that a conversation you are a part of?'
'The last time I ran into A.O.C., we were beating her endorsed candidate two to one in a primary, and I didn’t see her one minute of these midterms helping our House majority. So, I’m not sure what kind of advice she has, but I’m sure she’ll be generous with it.'
'But let’s be clear, she had almost nothing to do with what turned out to be an historic defense of our majority. Didn’t pay a dollar of dues. Didn’t do anything for our frontline candidates except give them money when they didn’t want it from her.'
'There are other voices who should be heard, especially when suburban voters have clearly rejected the ideas that she’s most associated with, from defunding the police on down. She’s an important voice in our politics. But when it comes to passing our agenda through the Congress, or standing our ground on the political battlefield, she was nowhere to be found.'
'Nationally, what are one or two things that surprised you in a positive way for the performance that allowed you to beat historic odds?'
'It was clearly a combination of having tackled real problems, bringing home real deliverables and running good campaigns, and our candidates. Both our incumbents and our challengers deserve enormous credit for the hard work they put in and the results they turned in, which as far as I can tell, exceed those of any House Democratic majority going back 60 years.'
'Here in New York, how much do you think redistricting mattered in the end?'
'If the top of the ticket is getting smoked in the New York City suburbs, you’re going to lose seats because those districts always have a degree of competitiveness. Albany passed different maps and the commission passed different maps, so it’s hard to talk in generalities.'
'But if you look at the districts in the Hudson Valley and on Long Island, it’s fair to say that we would have always struggled in an environment where the governor’s losing by double digits in those areas. Different lines wouldn’t have made much difference.'
'Pat Ryan is running in a district that was easier than mine. I’m running in a district that was easier than my old one. It’s just when you have voters in the booth who are voting against the top of the ticket by double digits, it’s very hard, particularly for a first-time candidate like some of ours, to overcome that.'
'Look, that’s not the only reason. And again, I don’t think it’s Gov. Hochul’s fault. But we clearly had a problem in the New York City suburbs that just didn’t exist elsewhere in the country, and I’m sure there’s enough blame to go around.'
###
Would that be Forgery Trailer Queene?
😂... I believe Forgery (MTG, if I’m not mistaken) is in GA.
OMG, you’re right [smacks forehead]!
Who is What’s Her Name in Alabama?
Katie Britt, I believe.
Ah. I’m not familiar with her. Thanks.
S. Georgia is next to Alabama. MTG is on my list. Bobert is gone, MTG's
next. Goetz too. I would donate to a
moderate republican, if they exist,
to unseat these 2.
She's on my list.😁
Well, I will bet the Texas Democratic Party could out screw any pouch. Disarray, disorganized, dis-funded, discombobulated, disassociated, disengaged.. And the chairman just got re elected this summer at the TDP Convention which was, by the way, a GOAT SCREWING! He is underhanded and dishonest and won by cheating. He has done ZERO for Democrats in this state. Notice how Beto had very little to do with them? Seriously, they act like Republicans. I am left wondering...is there any difference? Move along America, nothing to see here in the grand old Lone Star State. It’s a dumpster fire. The GOP has gerrymandering and voter suppression down to a science. Let’s hope other states don’t look over here for some tips. Not one fucking thing changed here during this election. Greg FUCKING Abbott got 4 more miserable years. I am sick and hopeless, but at least I have a GENERATOR!! Sorry for the rant
You may or may not have noticed, I, too, have rant tendencies... well done 👍🏼. I’m in IN ... I feel like we’re the Texas of the Midwest... we are RED hot, with a few blue pockets, mostly around universities.
Rant on, Rachel! I live in the dominantly blue People’s Republic of Massachusetts where I’m ecstatic that we just elected our former awesome kick-butt attorney gerneral Maura Healy as our first elected woman governor of the state and first out gay woman governor in the country along with a slate of amazing women leaders. But I still rant about the deplorable dominance of MAGA maniacs and fascists in so many states. Thank you for fighting the good fight in Texas! Have you connected with Blue Horizon Texas yet? They’re working hard and smart to organize and multiply the political power of Texas Democrats and progressives.
I will check that out. Thanks for the tip and glad for your state’s election results. 🤛🏼
❗️ ❗️ ❗️
Three things: First: boy, did we ever fuck the pooch; Second: one of the dipsticks elected to the House is the former Dutchess County Executive, Marcus Molinaro, a man whose lake of IQ points can be skated on, year-round (he comes to Washington complete with his educational credentials—a 2 year degree in political science from Dutchess Community College glistening in the sunshine); third: the execrable Elise Stefanik won her 5th term in the House.
Please, don't get up...I'll see myself out.
Get some sleep. You’re going to need energy to keep up the fight.
Screwed the pouch indeed. Several times over.
You have a great way with words!!
That's why it's the LAW of unintended consequences, not just a footnote that sometimes things happen that aren't planned for.
This is disturbingly infuriating. You know, I was listening to Professor Richardson’s talk from June 30 of this year. It’s on YouTube, if you care to listen to it. She explains clearly how we got here and who the “Originalists” are... without the backstory, which I’ve never seen laid out so succinctly as she managed, we’re just going to continue to flail. She does offer suggestions, but... sadly, my faith in the democrats is tanking. There’s cause to revise states rights, but it won’t happen with 5 of 9 SC judges being Originalists. We have to expand the court. And ... we have two years. How?
I need to listen to that one. I love HCR
Yes---Dim Democrats. And what a stupid, stupid move. And what a price the nation pays for that.
You're right about New York TAFM readers, of which I am one. I, and I'm quite certain many others, are royally pissed at the stupidity of our NY Dem Party! Thanks for seeing that we're not all fools!
My readers prove they're not fools by the fact they're here. :-)
New Yorkers! Take a page from Michigan's winning strategy!
https://votersnotpoliticians.com/
oy vey❗️ ❗️ ❗️