Regarding the steady flow of revelations pertaining to Trump’s efforts to overthrow the election and retain power, Jeffrey Engel, the director of the Center for Presidential History at Southern Methodist University, observed in the New York Times that voters had become desensitized, if not numb, to Trump’s attacks on democracy: “I actually think the American public is dramatically underplaying how significant and dangerous this is because we cannot process the basic truth of what we are learning about President Trump’s efforts—which is we’ve never had a president before who fundamentally placed his own personal interests above the nation’s.”
Donald Trump, first and foremost, is a teacher. He taught me not to trust my species because a large swath of it is suicidally stupid. I do not know where this tale of the malignant leading the blind ends but it is not in a happy place.
Please don't call him a teacher -- you insult those of us who have made teaching our career. He is a cult leader, a malevolent diabolist, a wicked gas lighter.
Rowshan, please don’t be offended… in my view, the most valuable thing a trained educator can do is awaken the spark of curiosity in all of us so we can pick at every situation or moment and find the lesson and learn from it. We all teach in the ways we live and interact because someone is watching and learning.
But we aren’t all trained educators. Much respect to you.
And not just ordinary people… but elected lawmakers… who continue to skew election rules and results in their favor. Yes, the immediate “end” looks decidedly unhappy and wicked.
'Is Trump’s wickedness too immense for us to absorb?' This was TC's question that came closest to the Trump Effect on me. He eats up space, fills ours ears, and assaults the senses. This piece by TC calls up the pain and suffering that is Trump. It uncomfortably reminded me of many millions who flock to him. His ugliness looks like a winner, a shiny gold mountain of success to his worshippers.
There are many questions around Trump. What is the America that elected him to the presidency? It isn't only the flaccidity of the Republicans; what of our government; what about his force so able to dominate and to have gotten away with evil for so long? It is very disturbing to feel him clinging to us. We cannot shake him. Trump has been carrying on for so long that he's inside us. Do we have a sense of guilt for not ridding ourselves of him? We don't want to absorb Trump, but he worked his way into our pores, our heads and our hearts. I think that we understand him; that we have absorbed him and that we cannot stand it. Trump dulls our hopes and our resiliency.
As a side note, comparisons between evil and wicked are as such:
'The two adjectives wicked and evil both have similar meanings; they both mean immoral or sinful. However, the adjective wicked also has some alternative meanings which sometimes have a very different meaning from evil. The key difference between wicked and evil is that wicked can have connotations of mischief, playfulness whereas evil is indicative is malevolence, immorality and sin'
Not exactly on point, but on one occassion when Jack Warner tried to invoke the shetl background, his interlocutor laughed and said: Come on, Jack. You were born in Canada.
Of course, there is the ongoing debate that long predated 1/6, over whether Trump was a Batman villain or Bond villain.
Maybe not the shtetl for all of them (for sure for Mayer and Goldwyn), but they had all experienced being Jews in countries where the dominant culture was consciously anti-Semitic, where there were "quotas" for allowing the advancement of Jews, where it was possible to feel one's future circumscribed by things one had not done.
I've long accepted that the former president is an evil person and a serial lawbreaker. What I can't accept is the possibility verging on probability that he'll get away with it because the people who are responsible for enforcing the law have rationalized away their willingness to do their jobs. If the Select Committee actually holds public hearings and they are serious like the Watergate hearings were, that will be a good first step but, absent jail time, heavy fines and a permanent ban from holding elected or appointed office in this country, the hearings themselves will accomplish nothing.
I agree with almost everything you’ve said here … and maybe you’re right and the reluctance of the committee, or the department of justice. Is because they have somehow rationalized away their willingness to do their jobs…. I’m not at all certain that’s true. There have been too many revelations, too much investigative work to shatter their willingness to proceed. We’ve never been in this place before… how is it done? And done properly? Is a jury trial the answer? Who sits on the jury? We tried to impeach him and members of Congress REFUSED to convict him. How do we make charges that will ensure consequences?
That is indeed the question and I don't have an answer other than the one we learned in Civics class in another century - a jury of his fellow citizens, a judge and a prosecutor who is committed to the rule of law even at the risk of her political career.
Agreed. That’s what we learned in Civics class. Let’s consider “fellow citizens “. One third of our fellow citizens have thrown their lot with these criminals. Will the verdict have to be unanimous to convict? Will the judge be from the SCOTUS? How would that play out? I would assume the prosecutor would come from the DOJ, can they do it? Trust me, I’m ready to see it happen, but I’m more ready to see it succeed! With consequences and extreme penalties. But how?
What I think feels hard to accept is that trump is doing criminal, evil things right out in the open, and our system does not hold him accountable. I don’t think the founders thought someone like trump would come to the presidency and not be held accountable. The constitutional safeguards don’t hold if those who are supposed to apply them shrug and say, “So what.”
Of all those who know him best, I put my money on Mary Trump. She has life experiences with him and has a PhD in clinical psychology. I'm a retired educator, but my expertise is not in that arena. However, I rely on Wikipedia and others with pedigrees that DO qualify them to diagnose and understand those monsters among us who are morally depraved. (I would venture to guess that most of them are locked up somewhere - if not in prison, then in some sort of institution. Think "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.")
Here's a definition of sociopath: "A person with a personality disorder manifesting itself in extreme antisocial attitudes and behavior and a lack of conscience." Here's a definition of psychopath: "A person suffering from chronic mental disorder with abnormal or violent social behavior."
Given what we know now about this monster, as a lay person struggling to understand mental incapacitation, I would guess the latter. His proclivity to harm others, insult others, and his gleefulness at the violence on J6, his desire for revenge and retaliation, put him in a category with others who are turned on by violence, in my uneducated opinion.
That said, I do think we who are somewhat "normal" have a hard time wrapping our brains around a monster who defies everything we have ever been taught about decency, and socially acceptable behavior, much less the difference between "right" and "wrong." Personally, I think I'm suffering from PTSD as a result of this monster. I keep using that term (monster) because it's the only one that seems to fit such a person.
It’s because of one of your points regarding a sociopath….”lack of conscience”. What always amazes people is that a sociopath “never learns”. They repeat and repeat and repeat. Those of us with a conscious conscience have trained ourselves to not repeat a wrong or “sin” or crime because of the guilt or shame or regret that our conscience lays on that act. With Mr. Trump, he somehow as a young child skipped a step and has never heeded a conscience. I remember thinking about him regarding this very thing when he became a serious contender and then possible winner of the election. I have come across only 3 six year olds in my career as an educator that I recognized as possibly a sociopath. Maybe sometime I will tell the stories of those children. I just wish I could have been there when child Donald hit the teacher, stoned the toddler, etc. If the correction is not made in childhood, then what the world gets as this child becomes an adult is pretty horrific. The blame rests on the people that could not see, were ready to believe him, and rubbed his snake oil in their faces and voted for him. The “handlers” in campaigns today are sometimes messing with things nobody has any business messing with.
I believe his downfall will be that he has a glitch in his senses. To pursue his power in still the political arena is ridiculous. He could go to multiple locations in the world as an oligarch and carry on his nonsense. What he cannot do is let go of the obsessive factor in his sociopathic makeup that runs on a 10 out of 10 and is the reason that we the people must never allow him back in office. And that factor is revenge. In his mind, a large, garish, lit billboard flashes as he devours his devotional, Mein Kampf. “They done you wrong.” So he must regain the same seat of power to wreak his revenge.
Absolutely! I have no words to add to what you've written. (Of course I'll add a few!)
I think we have a difficult time using the words wicked and evil. They sound so Byzantine, so "right wing christian-small c". But they apply to the former "president". I think apt likenesses are Hitler and his crowd. Idi Amin and other killers at the heads of nations through centuries. Unfortunately the guy seems to reveal the reflection in the mirror of a nation that has counted on bluster, huge amounts of money, subterfuge, cruelty and manipulation to reach its "goals". That isn't all we've had as a nation, and we know that. There has been plenty of good, of caring, of humility, of honor, of action to right the wrongs of the past and the present. But what the guy seems to have proven is that the system of rapacious capitalism birthed here does indeed rot the organism from the inside out. We are all individually and together that organism. He is the Hollow Man. The prophet Amos tells us, the rich lay on their ivory beds with others of their own ilk, and make their plans without regard to the outcome for any but themselves. That's what makes the current situation so terrible. That he was not convicted by the gop led Senate especially following the attempted coup proves how venal that group have become. I too welcome the April hearings. We must not flinch.
People are attracted to shiney objects. The golden calf story comes to mind. What did Moses and Aaron do to dissuade the masses from their obsession to a golden (orange) object? What motivated them to abandon their well-intentioned leaders? Age old lessons sometimes ring true.
Donald Trump, first and foremost, is a teacher. He taught me not to trust my species because a large swath of it is suicidally stupid. I do not know where this tale of the malignant leading the blind ends but it is not in a happy place.
Please don't call him a teacher -- you insult those of us who have made teaching our career. He is a cult leader, a malevolent diabolist, a wicked gas lighter.
Rowshan, please don’t be offended… in my view, the most valuable thing a trained educator can do is awaken the spark of curiosity in all of us so we can pick at every situation or moment and find the lesson and learn from it. We all teach in the ways we live and interact because someone is watching and learning.
But we aren’t all trained educators. Much respect to you.
Thank you, Carla!
He is still also a teacher. And all those other things.
And not just ordinary people… but elected lawmakers… who continue to skew election rules and results in their favor. Yes, the immediate “end” looks decidedly unhappy and wicked.
'Is Trump’s wickedness too immense for us to absorb?' This was TC's question that came closest to the Trump Effect on me. He eats up space, fills ours ears, and assaults the senses. This piece by TC calls up the pain and suffering that is Trump. It uncomfortably reminded me of many millions who flock to him. His ugliness looks like a winner, a shiny gold mountain of success to his worshippers.
There are many questions around Trump. What is the America that elected him to the presidency? It isn't only the flaccidity of the Republicans; what of our government; what about his force so able to dominate and to have gotten away with evil for so long? It is very disturbing to feel him clinging to us. We cannot shake him. Trump has been carrying on for so long that he's inside us. Do we have a sense of guilt for not ridding ourselves of him? We don't want to absorb Trump, but he worked his way into our pores, our heads and our hearts. I think that we understand him; that we have absorbed him and that we cannot stand it. Trump dulls our hopes and our resiliency.
As a side note, comparisons between evil and wicked are as such:
'The two adjectives wicked and evil both have similar meanings; they both mean immoral or sinful. However, the adjective wicked also has some alternative meanings which sometimes have a very different meaning from evil. The key difference between wicked and evil is that wicked can have connotations of mischief, playfulness whereas evil is indicative is malevolence, immorality and sin'
Oh Fern, the gut-wrenching reality of evil.
Not exactly on point, but on one occassion when Jack Warner tried to invoke the shetl background, his interlocutor laughed and said: Come on, Jack. You were born in Canada.
Of course, there is the ongoing debate that long predated 1/6, over whether Trump was a Batman villain or Bond villain.
Maybe not the shtetl for all of them (for sure for Mayer and Goldwyn), but they had all experienced being Jews in countries where the dominant culture was consciously anti-Semitic, where there were "quotas" for allowing the advancement of Jews, where it was possible to feel one's future circumscribed by things one had not done.
Definitely a Batman villain.
I've long accepted that the former president is an evil person and a serial lawbreaker. What I can't accept is the possibility verging on probability that he'll get away with it because the people who are responsible for enforcing the law have rationalized away their willingness to do their jobs. If the Select Committee actually holds public hearings and they are serious like the Watergate hearings were, that will be a good first step but, absent jail time, heavy fines and a permanent ban from holding elected or appointed office in this country, the hearings themselves will accomplish nothing.
I agree with almost everything you’ve said here … and maybe you’re right and the reluctance of the committee, or the department of justice. Is because they have somehow rationalized away their willingness to do their jobs…. I’m not at all certain that’s true. There have been too many revelations, too much investigative work to shatter their willingness to proceed. We’ve never been in this place before… how is it done? And done properly? Is a jury trial the answer? Who sits on the jury? We tried to impeach him and members of Congress REFUSED to convict him. How do we make charges that will ensure consequences?
That is indeed the question and I don't have an answer other than the one we learned in Civics class in another century - a jury of his fellow citizens, a judge and a prosecutor who is committed to the rule of law even at the risk of her political career.
Agreed. That’s what we learned in Civics class. Let’s consider “fellow citizens “. One third of our fellow citizens have thrown their lot with these criminals. Will the verdict have to be unanimous to convict? Will the judge be from the SCOTUS? How would that play out? I would assume the prosecutor would come from the DOJ, can they do it? Trust me, I’m ready to see it happen, but I’m more ready to see it succeed! With consequences and extreme penalties. But how?
I’ll ALMOST settle for his not being able to run again. But if DOJ is afraid of violence they should be prepared for some reaction if NOTHING is done
What I think feels hard to accept is that trump is doing criminal, evil things right out in the open, and our system does not hold him accountable. I don’t think the founders thought someone like trump would come to the presidency and not be held accountable. The constitutional safeguards don’t hold if those who are supposed to apply them shrug and say, “So what.”
and awaiting DOJ actions...
I hate to say it, but I think we'll be awaiting for awhile.
Waiting for Godot
Interesting assessment. It certainly seems to fit; we cannot conceive that level of wickedness carried out with such malevolent intent.
Of all those who know him best, I put my money on Mary Trump. She has life experiences with him and has a PhD in clinical psychology. I'm a retired educator, but my expertise is not in that arena. However, I rely on Wikipedia and others with pedigrees that DO qualify them to diagnose and understand those monsters among us who are morally depraved. (I would venture to guess that most of them are locked up somewhere - if not in prison, then in some sort of institution. Think "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest.")
Here's a definition of sociopath: "A person with a personality disorder manifesting itself in extreme antisocial attitudes and behavior and a lack of conscience." Here's a definition of psychopath: "A person suffering from chronic mental disorder with abnormal or violent social behavior."
Given what we know now about this monster, as a lay person struggling to understand mental incapacitation, I would guess the latter. His proclivity to harm others, insult others, and his gleefulness at the violence on J6, his desire for revenge and retaliation, put him in a category with others who are turned on by violence, in my uneducated opinion.
That said, I do think we who are somewhat "normal" have a hard time wrapping our brains around a monster who defies everything we have ever been taught about decency, and socially acceptable behavior, much less the difference between "right" and "wrong." Personally, I think I'm suffering from PTSD as a result of this monster. I keep using that term (monster) because it's the only one that seems to fit such a person.
It’s because of one of your points regarding a sociopath….”lack of conscience”. What always amazes people is that a sociopath “never learns”. They repeat and repeat and repeat. Those of us with a conscious conscience have trained ourselves to not repeat a wrong or “sin” or crime because of the guilt or shame or regret that our conscience lays on that act. With Mr. Trump, he somehow as a young child skipped a step and has never heeded a conscience. I remember thinking about him regarding this very thing when he became a serious contender and then possible winner of the election. I have come across only 3 six year olds in my career as an educator that I recognized as possibly a sociopath. Maybe sometime I will tell the stories of those children. I just wish I could have been there when child Donald hit the teacher, stoned the toddler, etc. If the correction is not made in childhood, then what the world gets as this child becomes an adult is pretty horrific. The blame rests on the people that could not see, were ready to believe him, and rubbed his snake oil in their faces and voted for him. The “handlers” in campaigns today are sometimes messing with things nobody has any business messing with.
I believe his downfall will be that he has a glitch in his senses. To pursue his power in still the political arena is ridiculous. He could go to multiple locations in the world as an oligarch and carry on his nonsense. What he cannot do is let go of the obsessive factor in his sociopathic makeup that runs on a 10 out of 10 and is the reason that we the people must never allow him back in office. And that factor is revenge. In his mind, a large, garish, lit billboard flashes as he devours his devotional, Mein Kampf. “They done you wrong.” So he must regain the same seat of power to wreak his revenge.
Absolutely! I have no words to add to what you've written. (Of course I'll add a few!)
I think we have a difficult time using the words wicked and evil. They sound so Byzantine, so "right wing christian-small c". But they apply to the former "president". I think apt likenesses are Hitler and his crowd. Idi Amin and other killers at the heads of nations through centuries. Unfortunately the guy seems to reveal the reflection in the mirror of a nation that has counted on bluster, huge amounts of money, subterfuge, cruelty and manipulation to reach its "goals". That isn't all we've had as a nation, and we know that. There has been plenty of good, of caring, of humility, of honor, of action to right the wrongs of the past and the present. But what the guy seems to have proven is that the system of rapacious capitalism birthed here does indeed rot the organism from the inside out. We are all individually and together that organism. He is the Hollow Man. The prophet Amos tells us, the rich lay on their ivory beds with others of their own ilk, and make their plans without regard to the outcome for any but themselves. That's what makes the current situation so terrible. That he was not convicted by the gop led Senate especially following the attempted coup proves how venal that group have become. I too welcome the April hearings. We must not flinch.
People are attracted to shiney objects. The golden calf story comes to mind. What did Moses and Aaron do to dissuade the masses from their obsession to a golden (orange) object? What motivated them to abandon their well-intentioned leaders? Age old lessons sometimes ring true.
TC, this is deep. Will respond later. Excellent.