The U.S. legal system is so screwy. None of the 91 indictments Trump currently faces nor any resulting convictions would disqualify his 2024 presidential candidacy, but a felony conviction will see him lose for life the right to vote in his home state of Florida, unless the Governor restores that right. Here's what I don't understand as …
The U.S. legal system is so screwy. None of the 91 indictments Trump currently faces nor any resulting convictions would disqualify his 2024 presidential candidacy, but a felony conviction will see him lose for life the right to vote in his home state of Florida, unless the Governor restores that right. Here's what I don't understand as I've watched the situatation unfold over these last three years. Three years! The U.S Constitution Amendmment 14, S3 disqualifies from political, civil, military, or judicial office any person who having taken an oath to support the Constitution of the United States and then engages in insurrection or rebellion against it, or gives aid or comfort to the enemies of. It referred to the Civil War. Was the occurence at the Capitol on January 6, 2021 an insurrection or rebellion?
"Insurrection: an organized attempt by a group of people to defeat their government and take control of their country, usually by violence."
"Rebellion: violent action organized by a group of people who are trying to change the political system in their country."
I can understand why the DOJ has shied away from trying to prove to a jury that one of those occured. Twenty two months after the events of Jan. 6 2021, five Oathkeepers were found guilty of obstructing an official proceeding, among other charges, with two also convicted for seditious conspiracy (which is not the same as insurrection or rebellion). None were office holders having given oaths to the Constitution. “The seditious conspiracy charge alleges as one of its two objects to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States by force. The law of the United States, for the purposes of this charge, are the laws governing the transfer of power” (outlined in the Constitution) - District Judge Amit Mehta.
Six months later (May 2023) four Proud Boys were also found guilty of seditious conspiracy, again with other charges such as obstruction of an official proceeding.
So now, three years and a month later the "Sedition" has been proven and recorded, some foot soldiers are incarcerated and your legal system is flailing about with attempts to disqualify the figurehead from appearing on the ballot papers for an election day 39 weeks away. Meanwhile your nation's entire legislative process involving budgets and borders has stalled and is a seized hostage like an Israeli citizen, being held by your very own Hamas who, having tunnelled under the walls of the Rebublican party, appear to have found 250 or so Congressional members with instant Stockholm syndrome.
The whole world saw the the little shits on Jan. 6. The C Jan. 6 committee showed us the big orange turd, they referred him and others to the Justice Department on criminal charges. And others! Enablers such as John Eastman (obstruction of an official proceeding and conspiracy to defraud the United States). They also referred four members of Congress to the House’s Ethics Committee after those members did not comply with the subpoenas from the panel (Enablers Kevin McCarthy, Jim Jordan, Andy Biggs, Scott Perry). What I want to know is; why have some of the politicians (particularly those Freedom Caucus members who met with officials at Trump's White House in December 2020 and/or objected to the counting of the electoral votes on Jan. 6-7 2021) not been indicted for one or more of the following same charges as Trump?
a) Conspiracy to defraud the United States. For spreading false claims about the November 2020 election while knowing they were not true and for allegedly attempting to illegally discount legitimate votes all with the goal of overturning the 2020 election.
b) Conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding. For conspiring, with Trump, to block the official certification proceeding in Congress.
Why have those enablers not been held to account for their complicity? Squandered opportunity. Had the charges been laid and those middle shits been prosecuted there's every possibility that a clean budget bill wold have passed and Ukraine and Israel would have their aid by now. Democrats might even be holding a majority in the House. Probably not, realisticaly, but you never know how the timing of the elections for those vacated seats may have affected results. Instead you currently have this Trojan Horse minority of insurrectionists operating operating without violence to overthrow your government from within and take control of the country.
It may upset some, but this is how the world is beginning to view you. America's actions and lack thereof belie the noble words spoken and the high opinion you hold of your systems and your self. Fickle. Can't keep the promises made to Ukraine. Can't influence Israel to stop murdering women and children.
You've laid it out entirely right. It turns out that our system was developed with a big assumption in it - that truly bad men would not be elected to office. It was, to say the least, naive. Today, with the way the other side has skewed the public perception and understanding of politics (most don't really understand, because even the simple civics education that was available when I was in school no longer exists), there is fear on the part of people who never thought they would ever have to deal with such a situation, about what would happen if they did take action. Yeah, the world's strongest country is a helpless giant, tied down by the Lilliputians.
The U.S. legal system is so screwy. None of the 91 indictments Trump currently faces nor any resulting convictions would disqualify his 2024 presidential candidacy, but a felony conviction will see him lose for life the right to vote in his home state of Florida, unless the Governor restores that right. Here's what I don't understand as I've watched the situatation unfold over these last three years. Three years! The U.S Constitution Amendmment 14, S3 disqualifies from political, civil, military, or judicial office any person who having taken an oath to support the Constitution of the United States and then engages in insurrection or rebellion against it, or gives aid or comfort to the enemies of. It referred to the Civil War. Was the occurence at the Capitol on January 6, 2021 an insurrection or rebellion?
"Insurrection: an organized attempt by a group of people to defeat their government and take control of their country, usually by violence."
"Rebellion: violent action organized by a group of people who are trying to change the political system in their country."
I can understand why the DOJ has shied away from trying to prove to a jury that one of those occured. Twenty two months after the events of Jan. 6 2021, five Oathkeepers were found guilty of obstructing an official proceeding, among other charges, with two also convicted for seditious conspiracy (which is not the same as insurrection or rebellion). None were office holders having given oaths to the Constitution. “The seditious conspiracy charge alleges as one of its two objects to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States by force. The law of the United States, for the purposes of this charge, are the laws governing the transfer of power” (outlined in the Constitution) - District Judge Amit Mehta.
Six months later (May 2023) four Proud Boys were also found guilty of seditious conspiracy, again with other charges such as obstruction of an official proceeding.
So now, three years and a month later the "Sedition" has been proven and recorded, some foot soldiers are incarcerated and your legal system is flailing about with attempts to disqualify the figurehead from appearing on the ballot papers for an election day 39 weeks away. Meanwhile your nation's entire legislative process involving budgets and borders has stalled and is a seized hostage like an Israeli citizen, being held by your very own Hamas who, having tunnelled under the walls of the Rebublican party, appear to have found 250 or so Congressional members with instant Stockholm syndrome.
The whole world saw the the little shits on Jan. 6. The C Jan. 6 committee showed us the big orange turd, they referred him and others to the Justice Department on criminal charges. And others! Enablers such as John Eastman (obstruction of an official proceeding and conspiracy to defraud the United States). They also referred four members of Congress to the House’s Ethics Committee after those members did not comply with the subpoenas from the panel (Enablers Kevin McCarthy, Jim Jordan, Andy Biggs, Scott Perry). What I want to know is; why have some of the politicians (particularly those Freedom Caucus members who met with officials at Trump's White House in December 2020 and/or objected to the counting of the electoral votes on Jan. 6-7 2021) not been indicted for one or more of the following same charges as Trump?
a) Conspiracy to defraud the United States. For spreading false claims about the November 2020 election while knowing they were not true and for allegedly attempting to illegally discount legitimate votes all with the goal of overturning the 2020 election.
b) Conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding. For conspiring, with Trump, to block the official certification proceeding in Congress.
Why have those enablers not been held to account for their complicity? Squandered opportunity. Had the charges been laid and those middle shits been prosecuted there's every possibility that a clean budget bill wold have passed and Ukraine and Israel would have their aid by now. Democrats might even be holding a majority in the House. Probably not, realisticaly, but you never know how the timing of the elections for those vacated seats may have affected results. Instead you currently have this Trojan Horse minority of insurrectionists operating operating without violence to overthrow your government from within and take control of the country.
It may upset some, but this is how the world is beginning to view you. America's actions and lack thereof belie the noble words spoken and the high opinion you hold of your systems and your self. Fickle. Can't keep the promises made to Ukraine. Can't influence Israel to stop murdering women and children.
You've laid it out entirely right. It turns out that our system was developed with a big assumption in it - that truly bad men would not be elected to office. It was, to say the least, naive. Today, with the way the other side has skewed the public perception and understanding of politics (most don't really understand, because even the simple civics education that was available when I was in school no longer exists), there is fear on the part of people who never thought they would ever have to deal with such a situation, about what would happen if they did take action. Yeah, the world's strongest country is a helpless giant, tied down by the Lilliputians.
very beautifully put, Craig.
nothing "vague" here at all...mebbe time to change your handle?