I will tell you why. He’s making it sound that every Jew agrees with this rabbi who is a shonda to the Jewish people. Judaism is like a scale with people that are secular Jews on one side and the ultra orthodox on the other. So, you really can’t pigeonhole us. He is not explaining this at all. I lived in Israel, and I have many friends t…
I will tell you why. He’s making it sound that every Jew agrees with this rabbi who is a shonda to the Jewish people. Judaism is like a scale with people that are secular Jews on one side and the ultra orthodox on the other. So, you really can’t pigeonhole us. He is not explaining this at all. I lived in Israel, and I have many friends that have served in Israel and now their kids are serving in Israel. Not everyone is like this Rabbi.
That is not at all what I said, or Mehdi Hassan said. It turns out there are right wing asshole Jews, just like there are right wing asshole Americans. Perhaps you might want to look up the history of the Likud Party that formed Netanyahu. It was founded by Jewish fascists who admired Mussolini, and who were willing to cooperate with the SS against the British until Kristallnacht got them enough public condemnation from the community that they went radio silent on that. These people are as much a blot on the history of Jewish people and Israel as my buffalo-killing/Indian-fighting genocidaire great-great grandfather.
Thank you for the history lesson but you don’t need to school me on any history pertaining to Israel or the Jewish people. I always learned in writing class that you write to the lowest common denominator in an essay such as this. If I read this and my take away was that Jews are bad then I think it does say that. I am sure that you know that there is no differentiation between Zionests and Jews right now. That is my point and also the fact that you didn’t point out that Israel is a democracy and people have been demonstrating for months for new elections because they too want to get rid of Netanyahu. But the article reads like all Israelis are bad. And that is not an objective way to write an essay.
"But the article reads like all Israelis are bad."
huh, not my takeaway on this article at all. But your opinion is valid for you.
Also, you wrote, "Thank you for the history lesson but you don’t need to school me on any history pertaining to Israel or the Jewish people."
You're right, you needed to unsubscribe since you already know everything. TC is very forthright and sometimes to the point of being offensive to many others (based on my observations over the past few years in other Substacks) so you'll be more comfortable not reading or engaging in his forum.
Take care, and have a good life. Peace be with you.
An estimated 30,000 dead in Gaza already and the killing continues. It's hard to be "objective" about that. I've been a regular reader of +972 Magazine (https://www.972mag.com/) for several years, so I'm aware that by no means all Israelis support Netanyahu. But still -- the killing continues.
Will Netanyahu stop carpet bombing then? Bibi's stupid tactics (he needs war and death in Gaza to stay out of jail) may have killed hostages. We know the IDF has.
Return the hostages and tear down the settlements.
Wow! I am really taking up space in your head! That is how Israeli reverence for life; giving back 2000 for 1; got totally turned inside out to vilify Israelis. Mazel tov on your critical thinking!
Not arguing anything about ceasefires but since you bring it up: Hamas offered the hostages back for a ceasefire? Did not see that. Please send link to that article.
I'm sorry it sounds that way to you. TC tends to be very forthright & out front with what he believes - that is what it is. I think he and most of the people who comment here are aware of the different groups that make up Judaism. But almost every religion has its different groups that make up the whole. From what I've read, there is a lot of disagreement in the Israeli public.
But Leila, what this particular Rabbi - someone with a great deal of influence - is saying sounds a lot like the extremist views of many other religions.
You are correct. This rabbi does sound and is extremist and I would never support him. But that’s the same in every religion. Don’t you think Hamas is extreme?
Of course we do! October 7 was terrible. However, 1,200 dead Israelis is not justification of a "Warsaw Ghetto" style campaign in Gaza that results in 30,000+ deaths over the course of a bit over four months. And watching the self-made videos of IDF members publicly celebrating their participation in what are obvious war crimes makes me sick. I am reminded of the Israeli Sabra I knew in grad school who had been a platoon leader in the infantry company that liberated the Wailing Wall in 1967. He told me as they stood there and worshiped as Jews there for the first time in 20 years, he heard his company commander's prayer: "Help us God. We won!" Israel needed that help and too many there - like Netanyahu and the rest of the Likud fascists - took advantage of the situation to push their ultimately terrible vision.
Absolutely - Hamas, and all the other offshoots in different countries. What Hamas did on the 7th of Oct was horrific - no question. Hiding among the Palestinian people and using tunnels underneath hospitals etc? Horrific. For the Palestinian civilians to have to exist with it - lose their homes - and lives because of it & be unable to do anything to stop it is also horrific.
Extremism is all around ALL of us - domestic terrorism right here amongst us! It only makes it more important to speak up against it.
My problem is that the speaking up is one sided and most of the time are simply lies. But I have no desire to get into a discussion about that. I was merely suggesting that in this case, a little more diplomacy would have been helpful. Thank you for condemning Hamas. Most people do not.
Jews who act like Nazis have pretty much abandoned all the amazing things I have learned Judaism is about. Americans who act like Nazis have pretty much abandoned all the amazing things we like about ourselves. My point is that the operative word is Nazi.
Yeah - there is a one side to that. And I have to admit when it comes to being too vocal about the current political situation - I hesitate. Too much vitriol on the other side.
It seems as though far too many who I guess want to speak up for the Palestinians and criticize the Jews seem to lack understanding of the gap between the Jewish people and the Netanyahu government OR the gap between Hamas and the civilians. They tend to treat each "side" as a single entity.
I have been waiting for years for something to blow up. Netanyahu has provoked for decades, maybe by allowing the settlements. This is a “we’ve got it and you ain’t getting it back” move which is a bully play any way you cut it. I am so sick of bullies and the idiots who think they are the best that a civilized people can come up with.
You are dead wrong about the idea that 'most people" support Hamas. A few do--hell, some people still support Stalin--and their antics are what in this day and age is considered "newsworthy" so you see a lot about them. But they are newsworthy BECAUSE they are aberrant.
I have long been disgusted by the insistence of some that being Pro Palestinian Civilians means being Pro-Hamas. It is a root failure to distinguish that often arises from living in a bubble--not unlike Fox viewers in their bubble being unable to distinguish trump's ramblings from Biden's sharp wittiness and going on about "age."
It is also a root failure to distinguish between the Israeli policies that Hamas protested (which were true) and the cynical and horrendous ways they expressed that protest.
Might be a good idea to stay here and see what people outside your bubble are saying.
I will tell you why. He’s making it sound that every Jew agrees with this rabbi who is a shonda to the Jewish people. Judaism is like a scale with people that are secular Jews on one side and the ultra orthodox on the other. So, you really can’t pigeonhole us. He is not explaining this at all. I lived in Israel, and I have many friends that have served in Israel and now their kids are serving in Israel. Not everyone is like this Rabbi.
That is not at all what I said, or Mehdi Hassan said. It turns out there are right wing asshole Jews, just like there are right wing asshole Americans. Perhaps you might want to look up the history of the Likud Party that formed Netanyahu. It was founded by Jewish fascists who admired Mussolini, and who were willing to cooperate with the SS against the British until Kristallnacht got them enough public condemnation from the community that they went radio silent on that. These people are as much a blot on the history of Jewish people and Israel as my buffalo-killing/Indian-fighting genocidaire great-great grandfather.
Thank you for the history lesson but you don’t need to school me on any history pertaining to Israel or the Jewish people. I always learned in writing class that you write to the lowest common denominator in an essay such as this. If I read this and my take away was that Jews are bad then I think it does say that. I am sure that you know that there is no differentiation between Zionests and Jews right now. That is my point and also the fact that you didn’t point out that Israel is a democracy and people have been demonstrating for months for new elections because they too want to get rid of Netanyahu. But the article reads like all Israelis are bad. And that is not an objective way to write an essay.
"But the article reads like all Israelis are bad."
huh, not my takeaway on this article at all. But your opinion is valid for you.
Also, you wrote, "Thank you for the history lesson but you don’t need to school me on any history pertaining to Israel or the Jewish people."
You're right, you needed to unsubscribe since you already know everything. TC is very forthright and sometimes to the point of being offensive to many others (based on my observations over the past few years in other Substacks) so you'll be more comfortable not reading or engaging in his forum.
Take care, and have a good life. Peace be with you.
An estimated 30,000 dead in Gaza already and the killing continues. It's hard to be "objective" about that. I've been a regular reader of +972 Magazine (https://www.972mag.com/) for several years, so I'm aware that by no means all Israelis support Netanyahu. But still -- the killing continues.
Return the hostages….
Will Netanyahu stop carpet bombing then? Bibi's stupid tactics (he needs war and death in Gaza to stay out of jail) may have killed hostages. We know the IDF has.
Return the hostages and tear down the settlements.
How about returning Palestine to the Palestinians -- or at least giving them equal rights in their homeland?
Why are you being so nasty? It is people like you that I am most afraid of.
So one Israeli is worth 2,000 Palestinians?
Wow! I am really taking up space in your head! That is how Israeli reverence for life; giving back 2000 for 1; got totally turned inside out to vilify Israelis. Mazel tov on your critical thinking!
Hamas offered, a while ago. Bibi said no, with no apparent reasoning other than he didn't believe Hamas.
Not arguing anything about ceasefires but since you bring it up: Hamas offered the hostages back for a ceasefire? Did not see that. Please send link to that article.
Here you go.
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/gaza-mediators-search-final-formula-israel-hamas-ceasefire-2024-02-07/#:~:text=DOHA%2FTEL%20AVIV%2C%20Feb%207,for%20negotiation%20toward%20an%20agreement.
Nah, not what I read
I'm sorry it sounds that way to you. TC tends to be very forthright & out front with what he believes - that is what it is. I think he and most of the people who comment here are aware of the different groups that make up Judaism. But almost every religion has its different groups that make up the whole. From what I've read, there is a lot of disagreement in the Israeli public.
But Leila, what this particular Rabbi - someone with a great deal of influence - is saying sounds a lot like the extremist views of many other religions.
You are correct. This rabbi does sound and is extremist and I would never support him. But that’s the same in every religion. Don’t you think Hamas is extreme?
Of course we do! October 7 was terrible. However, 1,200 dead Israelis is not justification of a "Warsaw Ghetto" style campaign in Gaza that results in 30,000+ deaths over the course of a bit over four months. And watching the self-made videos of IDF members publicly celebrating their participation in what are obvious war crimes makes me sick. I am reminded of the Israeli Sabra I knew in grad school who had been a platoon leader in the infantry company that liberated the Wailing Wall in 1967. He told me as they stood there and worshiped as Jews there for the first time in 20 years, he heard his company commander's prayer: "Help us God. We won!" Israel needed that help and too many there - like Netanyahu and the rest of the Likud fascists - took advantage of the situation to push their ultimately terrible vision.
Absolutely - Hamas, and all the other offshoots in different countries. What Hamas did on the 7th of Oct was horrific - no question. Hiding among the Palestinian people and using tunnels underneath hospitals etc? Horrific. For the Palestinian civilians to have to exist with it - lose their homes - and lives because of it & be unable to do anything to stop it is also horrific.
Extremism is all around ALL of us - domestic terrorism right here amongst us! It only makes it more important to speak up against it.
My problem is that the speaking up is one sided and most of the time are simply lies. But I have no desire to get into a discussion about that. I was merely suggesting that in this case, a little more diplomacy would have been helpful. Thank you for condemning Hamas. Most people do not.
So far, "a little diplomacy" has resulted only in things going from bad to worse in the past 57 years.
Yeah appears we need a whole big mess of diplomacy and a whole big mess LESS of military!
I meant diplomacy as far as denigrating Jews..
Jews who act like Nazis have pretty much abandoned all the amazing things I have learned Judaism is about. Americans who act like Nazis have pretty much abandoned all the amazing things we like about ourselves. My point is that the operative word is Nazi.
hear, hear!!
Yeah - there is a one side to that. And I have to admit when it comes to being too vocal about the current political situation - I hesitate. Too much vitriol on the other side.
It seems as though far too many who I guess want to speak up for the Palestinians and criticize the Jews seem to lack understanding of the gap between the Jewish people and the Netanyahu government OR the gap between Hamas and the civilians. They tend to treat each "side" as a single entity.
I have been waiting for years for something to blow up. Netanyahu has provoked for decades, maybe by allowing the settlements. This is a “we’ve got it and you ain’t getting it back” move which is a bully play any way you cut it. I am so sick of bullies and the idiots who think they are the best that a civilized people can come up with.
I agree, Jeri and the most vocal bully of all is still our very own home grown one!
Repubs dredged the sea floor for that detritus
thank you Maggie. You are a voice of reason
sometimes I am -sometimes I'm not, Leila! But thank you for the compliment
You are dead wrong about the idea that 'most people" support Hamas. A few do--hell, some people still support Stalin--and their antics are what in this day and age is considered "newsworthy" so you see a lot about them. But they are newsworthy BECAUSE they are aberrant.
I have long been disgusted by the insistence of some that being Pro Palestinian Civilians means being Pro-Hamas. It is a root failure to distinguish that often arises from living in a bubble--not unlike Fox viewers in their bubble being unable to distinguish trump's ramblings from Biden's sharp wittiness and going on about "age."
It is also a root failure to distinguish between the Israeli policies that Hamas protested (which were true) and the cynical and horrendous ways they expressed that protest.
Might be a good idea to stay here and see what people outside your bubble are saying.